Can I obtain a Thai tax ID number and tax residence status with a DTV visa if I stay more than six months?

@Rob ********

Hello, yes but too simple, only on income, if you have saving earn before you are thai tax resident and remit it , you don't pay on it .. but you need to be able to document it ...

Saving can be money in bank account, stocks, realestate ( you will pay tax for capital gain if exist for stocks/realestate ).

@Rob ********

even money you get before without pay tax ( for example if the country don't require to pay tax on some income you get ) you will not pay tax on it if you remit in thailand. ( it is saving prior your thai tax residence ). ( thailand is not implicated in your income (and tax related) that you get previously your thai tax resident.

For the new income money you get AFTER the year you become thai tax resident you pay tax on it in thailand if you remit the income here ( but you can use tax credit for tax you pay alread abroad on that (new) income ).

@Steve *******

yes, and the main tie-breaker is where you spend most of the time. (some exception may occur for example if your economic activity is in the country you spend less of your time)

@Steve *******

so if you get thai tax control in thailand, you will say that you are tax resident in Australia because you stay there 2 or 3 month per year ? and that you believe it make you that country tax resident because you chose it ?

@Steve *******

the problem in your strategy is to explain to thai tax officer that you are not thai tax resident because you go holiday in other country for 2 or 3 months per year, but maybe with good paper, certificate of tax residency, .. you may go throught ( i have some doubt ).

In my country they will laught at me if i say i have Certificate Tax Residency in thailand, live 9 months in my country, go 3 month holiday in thailand, and not willing to complete and pay tax in my country where i spend 9 month/year.

=> reversing thing still don't give you some warning ?

@Steve *******

you totaly ignore the reverse situation i give you.

If i go to Dubai, pay 0% tax , i stay dubai 3 month per year and go Australia for 9 month per year, i don't need to report and pay tax in Australia ? realy ? ( i take Dubai as example without check if they have DTA with Australia, but you can select a other country low tax with DTA ) (thailand for example :')

@Steve *******

yes, you are 3 b), the fact that you have propertie and stock in a country don't go over that you live month per year in a country.

I try to make you think outside the box with different situation to make you understand by yourself your "strategy" 😆

@Steve *******

i repeat, think reverse, if a thai citizen go to Australia, and stay in Australia for 9 month, and go thailand for 3 months. Don't report tax and don't pay tax in Australia ? you think ? (because he has realestate and stocks in Thailand ??).

It will be a incredible tax hole😅

For the economic ties, it is more for people who go out of the country for > 6 months (to avoid pay tax in is main country), but have business, wife, children (young), it is more a protection to avoid abuse of tax system for a country ( it is more a exception, and it is a very bad situation because if the 2 country don't agree you may even pay full tax on both country ).

The thai tax officer i speak is the one that may control you because you stay more than 6 months in Thailand.

@Steve *******

i don't ignore the DTA, the DTA allow to get lower tax on the source income ( for example dividend ) and allow to use it as tax credit.

For example, if the Company Coca send me dividend, i will pay 15% of america tax and not 30% because of the DTA, and if i remit it in Thailand, i can use tax credit of the 15% already paid for the thai tax.

@John *********

DTA is about double tax agrement, and not the tax residence ? it allow you to have tax credit / and or lower the tax from foreign country in your tax residence.

For example DTA even between european country allow to have lower tax from foreign country, but not 0%, for example for America, you pay 30% on dividend if your tax country has not DTA, but you can lower it to 15% ( so you have double tax, but lower ... ), same same between european country or all country with dta.

Some kind of income may even be 0% depending of the dta and the income ( i talk about dividend )

@Steve *******

it look little bit easy to spend 2 or 3 month per year in a other country and say "this is my permanent home" and my "tax home"

@Steve *******

yes, example : up to you for your personnal case (stay month in your home) :

Application in Tax Treaties

Under a DTA, the "permanent home test" is often the first step in resolving dual residency. If a person is considered a resident of both Australia and another country:

The tax treaty looks at where the individual has a permanent home.

If permanent homes exist in both countries, other criteria (e.g., center of vital interests, habitual abode) are considered.

Practical Steps to Determine Your Permanent Home:

Review where you spend most of your time.

Assess the nature and stability of your living arrangements in Australia.

Consider where your family and personal belongings are located.

Look into whether the overseas residence is intended to be temporary or permanent.

If in doubt, consult a tax professional or the Australian Taxation Office (ATO) to confirm your residency status and obligations.

@Steve *******

but how you can be tax resident in your home country if you never go there and have nothing there ?? you don't need to spend more than 6 month and/or don't have the most interest in this country ? i don't think you can "chose"

@Greg *******

normally the bank need to know you ciuntry tax resident, I am currently open new bank account (singuapore), they ask for tin number, it seems they don't need certificate ( it is chatgpt who tell me about this ... ) chatgpt think thai tin number will be not enough for my old country banks/brokers ...

I will ask when I go get my tin number.

Thx

@Greg *******

I apply citybank (based singuapore) , they ask in online form, and in some broker application I see I can fill tin number. Okay maybe chatgpt ask to much about tax resident , it look like it is "easy" to get tin number, a tax resident is like yearly document to attest everything ... because people could cheat and fill a tin number for year and change tax resident and keep other country tin ... ( I guess ... )

@Greg *******

thank you , very interesting ;.... and i read maybe in the future world income may be taxed in thailand even if not remited 🙁 ( but it is normal .. ), i don't know if they will/can keep LTR exception in the future

@Greg *******

yeah but now too much people can use it, they want to keep that only for them 😒, let see in the future .. for now it look very good.. if in future they tax globaly, I guess foreign dividend will be taxed as dividend income ( 10% ) very fair for me...

@Bob *********

I think people already give you this : just take a look here at the official (translated) document:



you will see if you open it .. nobody (here) will force you to see or do something..

@Romain ***

yeah, it is crazy, the arguments is "I don't hear people", "I need to see it", "i dont believe", "I wait somebody tell me to do", "i never do before, so i will never do" ... haha poor thai people who will need to manage this 😅

@Lachlan *********

but you need to do more than 6 month holiday out of Thailand, no 90 days 😅😅

@Lachlan *********

yes ok, but I was looking for people who stay in thailand and setup everything to be compliant with tax and tax rules.i am self financialy able to retire, it is better for me to be taxed here and don't go other country for 6 months.

you are right, but not easy to find, and a lot are about make business in thailand, not about internationnal tax ...

@Bob *********

yes, but you "probably" (certainly?) need to get tin in thailand and make tax report ( even if it is 0 )

@Bob *********

you wait somebody come knock at your door ?

@Steve *******

Benjamin just find a lot of future customers 😉 nice play Benjamin !

Maybe read this : /03/revenue-department-boss-calls-on-tax-residents-in-thailand-to-file-2024-runs-by-the-march-31st-deadline/

"Certainly, this year, all expats who have been residents of Thailand for 180 days or more in the course of the last year are liable to file a return. The return pertains to taxable income earned within Thailand and remitted to Thailand during 2024."

@James *******

I suggest you to read this /03/revenue-department-boss-calls-on-tax-residents-in-thailand-to-file-2024-runs-by-the-march-31st-deadline/